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Re: ARC 100 Prices

To: andy@waldorf-gmbh.de, broadley@neurocog.lrdc.pitt.edu
Subject: Re: ARC 100 Prices
From: Andreas Busse <andy@waldorf-gmbh.de>
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 94 09:15:22 +0100
Cc: riscy@sunsite.unc.edu
> Do I understand this correctly?  us$1185=410+550+40+33+motherboard$$$????
> So the motherboard alone cost $152??  (I hope so)

Sorry, NO. Motherboard price *without* any of the other cards is us$1185.

> > Video sub board, incl. 2 Meg VRAM   DM   700.-- / us$410.--
> Does this make sense compared to the nice S3-928 video boards
> (probably even eisa) for $300 or so?  (the s3 greatly reduces the
> load on the bus)

No, it doesn't make sense, you're right. But you don't need
to buy the ARC video board. You can use *any* video card you
like, even a $15 no-name 256k VGA card. 

> > Audio sub board                             DM   950.-- / us$550.--
> OUCH sounds way to much.  44.1 KHz 16 bit stereo play/record
> cost less then $200 for ISA maybe even eisa.  Sound boards don't
> push the bus very hard.

Right again. The audio sub board is so expensive because
of 4 (four!) large Altera FPGAs for DMA handling. Get something
else if you like. I don't recommend to use the ARC board (although
it sounds good, I have it in my Mips box).

> > Keyboard Ctrl. sub board            DM    55.-- / us$33.--
> Seems a prime candidate for putting on the motherboard, but it's cheap
> either way.

You're right again, but our goal is *not* to redesign the board.
That's why the whole thing is splitted into several boards.

> current CPU prices in qtys of 10:     
> (no retail price, this is the price we pay)
> R4400PC/50                            DM  1647,-- / us$968.--
> R4600-100                             DM   839.-- / us$493,--

> [comparison deleted]

> I believe Drew offered to handle the linux scsi driver for the NCR53cf94 
> (very nice chip from what I hear) chip if we decided to use it.  I'm not 
> sure this offer still stands.

Someone wrote that the Emulex FAS216 is compatible with the NCR 53cf94.

> A:  Change the motherboard to use NCR chip and take advantage of Drew's
>       help?
> B:  Or leave the motherboard design as is an write our own scsi driver for
>       this unknown (to me) emulex chip?  I worry about the emulex because
>       I haven't heard of it and linux doesn't support it yet.

See above.

> I personally could probably afford something more along the lines of a 
> R4200 ($150) + motherboard ($150) + cheap eisa video ($150) + keyboard $33

Forget that. I can't offer a board for $150 if I pay $300 for the
bus controller chips alone. To give you an idea how the boards
are calculated, I give you the formula:

        Part costs
      + Board costs
      + Production & Testing
        our costs

        our costs * 1.38  = retail price.

Perhaps you can imagine that we *need* some so-called profit
to handle support, repair service and so on. As you can see,
our initial costs of around us$10,000 for buying the design,
setting up production etc. aren't included in the calculation.
What do you think how many of these boards we could sell to
the riscy group ? 10 or 20 ? So, please, don't talk about
profit. There is none.

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